Reviewer #2 (Public review):
This study developed a setup for laminar fMRI at 3T that aimed to get the best from all worlds in terms of brain coverage, temporal resolution, sensitivity to detect functional responses and spatial specificity. They used a gradient-echo EPI readout to facilitate sensitivity, brain coverage and temporal resolution. The former was additionally boosted by NORDIC denoising and the latter two were further supported by acceleration both in-plane and across slices. The authors evaluated whether the implementation of velocity-nulling (VN) gradients could mitigate macrovascular bias, known to hamper laminar specificity of gradient-echo BOLD.
Strengths:
The setup includes 0.9 mm isotropic acquisitions with large coverage at a reasonable TR. These parameters are hard to optimize simultaneously, and I applaud the ambitious attempt to get "the best from all worlds" (large coverage, high spatio/temporal resolution, spatial specificity, sensitivity), which is sought after in the field. Also, in terms of the availability of the method, it is favorable that it benefits from lower field strength (additional time for VN-gradient implementation, afforded by longer gray matter T2*). Furthermore, I like that the authors took steps to improve the original manuscript by e.g., collecting more data, adjusting the VN implementation to include flow-suppression along three rather than a single dimension, and adjusting the ROI-definition procedure to avoid circularity issues.
That being said, I still find the evidence weak in terms of this sequence achieving high spatial specificity and sensitivity. The results feel oversold and further validation is needed to make a case for the authors' conclusion that "[...] the potential impact of this development is expected to be extensive across various domains of neuroscience research". This is elaborated in the comments below:
The authors acknowledge that the VN setup in its current form probably does not suppress the impact of most ascending veins (these are also not targeted by phase regression, as most are probably too small to produce sufficiently large phase responses). This seems to limit the theoretical support for the author's claim of reduced inter-layer blurring (e.g. the claim that deep and superficial signals are less coupled with VN gradients than without based on Fig 6-7). This limitation withstanding, the method may still be helpful for limiting laminar dependencies by suppressing pial vein responses (which may carry signal from distant regions and layers that blur into superficial layers if left unsuppressed). Unfortunately, the empirical support of VN gradients suppressing superficial bias seems quite weak and is hard to evaluate. For example, the profiles in Figure 4 does not consistently show clearly less superficial bias when VN gradients are on - this might partly be due to the fact that clear bias was not always present in the profiles even without VN. I suspect this is largely explained by the selection of very small and quite unrepresentative ROIs. The corresponding activation maps appear strongly weighted towards CSF which is not always captured in the profile. I recommend sampling a much larger patch of cortex to more accurately capture the actual underlying bias. In this way, all non-VN profiles should have clear bias which should be clearly suppressed for VN if the method is effective. The authors do evaluate the effect of VN/phase regression based on a large activated region in visual cortex (Fig 5) - why not show laminar profiles from here, which is an obvious way to show the effect on superficial bias? I think such evaluations would be a more direct way of evaluating the methods impact on specificity, and are necessary for subsequent FC evaluations to be convincing.
The phase regression results are described inconsistently. In the results section, the authors, in my opinion, "correctly" acknowledge that phase regression seemed to have a very minor impact. However, in the discussion section it is described as if phase regression was effective in suppressing macrovascular responses (L 553-558), which the results do not support (especially based on profiles in Fig 4). There is barely any difference with/without phase regression, which may be due to the fact that ordinary least squares regression was chosen over a deming model which accounts for noise on the phase regressor. Although the authors correctly mentioned in their "answers to reviewers" that the required noise-ratio between magnitude and phase data can be hard to estimate, attempts of that has been described in previous phase regression studies which showed much larger effects (see e.g. Stanley et al. 2020, Knudsen et al. 2023).
I like that the authors put in additional efforts to provide analyses to validate their NORDIC implementation. However, this needs to be done on the VN setup directly, not the "regular BOLD setup" with b=0, since the ability of NORDIC to distinguish signal and noise components depends on CNR which is expected to deviate for these setups. Also, it seems z-scores and confidence intervals were computed based on GLM residuals which may lead to inflated z-values and overly narrow CI's due to reduced degrees of freedom following denoising. The denoised z-maps from Fig 3 indeed look somewhat strange, i.e. seemingly increased false positives (more salt/pepper and a bunch of white matter activation) with very weak hand knob activation. Also, something must be wrong with the CIs on the laminar profiles - they seem extremely narrow despite noise levels obviously being high for highly accelerated 3T submillimeter results extracted from a very small ROI. The authors may consider computing these statistics from variance across trials instead.
Given that the idea of the setup is to take advantage in terms of sensitivity by using GE-BOLD contrast relative to e.g. SE-EPI or CBV-weighted setups, they need to carefully demonstrate the sensitivity of their setup, which could be limited by high acceleration factors, the VN gradients, low field strength, etc. I like that they now put more emphasis on non-masked activation maps, but further comparison could be made through tSNR maps, raw single-volume images, raw timeseries, CNR based on across-trial variance, etc.
The major rationale for the setup is to achieve functional connectivity (FC) with brain-wide coverage at laminar resolutions, but it is framed as if this is something that has not been possible in the past with existing setups (statements such as: "Despite advancements in acquisition speed, current CBV/CBF-based fMRI techniques remain inadequate for layer-dependent resting-state fMRI" (L138-140). To me, the functional connectivity results presented here with the VN setup are clearly less convincing than what has been shown with e.g. CBV-weighted acquisitions (e.g. Huber et al. 2021, Chai et al. 2024). The VN setup might also have advantages such as larger coverage as mentioned by the authors, but they fail to balance the comparison by highlighting where previous studies had clear edges. Thus, the impact of the results needs to be down-stated and a more balanced comparison with existing laminar FC studies is warranted. For example, acknowledging that the CBV-weighted studies demonstrate much higher spatial specificity.
Overall I would recommend a stronger emphasis on validating the claims about the sequence on task-based data for which there is a large body of literature to benchmark against (e.g. laminar fMRI studies in V1 and M1), before going to FC where the base for comparison and reference is much more limited in humans at laminar scales.